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Update on USB Disconnect Issues (unable to detect USB modules during scan)

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  • #16
    Originally posted by RoyM View Post
    Hi Tom,
    I just got off the phone with Modern Robotics to see about getting our CPDM repaired, and it was mentioned that the OTG cable is unusual in having the master-slave relationship swapped. Can you post a part number for the Monoprice cable so we can be sure that we get the right item?

    Roy
    Hi Roy,

    We have been using this Monoprice USB OTG adapter:

    http://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_i...2e0RoCjsjw_wcB

    We connect it to a Monoprice USB mini type B cable:

    http://www.monoprice.com/product?c_i...seq=1&format=2

    These two cables replace the single cable that was provided with the Power Module. Note that you can use a strip of electrical tape to secure the two cables together to make it a little hard to disconnect them during a match.

    Tom

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Tom Eng View Post
      Hi Roy,

      We have been using this Monoprice USB OTG adapter:

      http://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_i...2e0RoCjsjw_wcB

      We connect it to a Monoprice USB mini type B cable:

      http://www.monoprice.com/product?c_i...seq=1&format=2

      These two cables replace the single cable that was provided with the Power Module. Note that you can use a strip of electrical tape to secure the two cables together to make it a little hard to disconnect them during a match.

      Tom
      Interestingly, those are the exact ones we ordered to use in the exact same configuration, as we've been having the problem as well on two out of three robots. They should have arrived by now, but school is our for fall break and we don't have access to shipping, so hopefully we can play with them on Monday.

      We are planning to permanently attach the micro end to the phone so we never have to unplug it. Then we will use a regular USB (monoprice part 5441) to charge it.
      FTC 4962 / 3638
      FLL 11 / 21 / 9293

      Comment


      • #18
        Nevermind, I guess I posted that before on this thread. It won't let me edit/delete my post, though, for some reason.
        FTC 4962 / 3638
        FLL 11 / 21 / 9293

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Tom Eng View Post
          Hi Martin,

          I would like to make sure I understand the problems you are seeing. Your Robot Controller sometimes has problems seeing one of the two motor controllers. To rectify the problem you disconnect the cable from the Android phone that connects it to the Power distribution module? Does this problem occur when the robot is driving (even if it's driving slowly/not aggressively over a smooth surface) or does this happen when you restart your app or restart your power module and the robot controller fails on its attempt to scan for the configured hardware devices?

          Tom
          Tom,
          Thanks - I'd say: "both", although our most recent experience has been of the form:
          -drive robot.
          -power it down for tweaks
          -power robot up (phone was on the whole time)
          -scan partially fails. (by partially, I mean, one motor controller is still seen; the other not).
          But eventually, by power-cycling the phone and the robot, and at most only messing with the cable connections between phone and power distribution unit, sometimes it works again.
          Thanks,
          Martin
          Mentor, Team 7593 TigerBots

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by BSV View Post
            We are planning to permanently attach the micro end to the phone so we never have to unplug it. Then we will use a regular USB (monoprice part 5441) to charge it.
            Just as a word of caution: you won't be able to charge your phone if an OTG cable is attached. It's part of the USB spec to prevent damage to devices.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Jonathan Berling View Post
              Just as a word of caution: you won't be able to charge your phone if an OTG cable is attached. It's part of the USB spec to prevent damage to devices.
              OK, thanks. At least it should reduce the number of times it gets plugged / unplugged for loading programs (which is way more than charging).
              FTC 4962 / 3638
              FLL 11 / 21 / 9293

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Tom Eng View Post
                Hi Roy,

                We have been using this Monoprice USB OTG adapter:

                http://www.monoprice.com/Product?p_i...2e0RoCjsjw_wcB

                We connect it to a Monoprice USB mini type B cable:

                http://www.monoprice.com/product?c_i...seq=1&format=2

                These two cables replace the single cable that was provided with the Power Module. Note that you can use a strip of electrical tape to secure the two cables together to make it a little hard to disconnect them during a match.

                Tom
                Tom, I have ordered these. Would it not work?
                http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812400119

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Tom Eng View Post
                  Hi Joe,

                  That would be a question for Modern Robotics. I'll also ask and see if I can get a serial number range, but feel free to ping MR about this.

                  Tom

                  Bump for this, if they suspect something, serial numbers would be good.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by mikets View Post
                    Tom, I have ordered these. Would it not work?
                    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812400119
                    That won't, because it is a mini B female to micro B male. You need micro A male to mini B male.
                    FTC6460 mentor (software+computer vision+electronics), FPGA enthusiast. In favor of allowing custom electronics on FTC bots.
                    Co-founder of ##ftc live chat for FTC programming--currently you may need to join and wait some time for help--volunteer basis only.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Our team is having the same problems as all the other teams; If we are lucky we can find one controller, sometimes the scan does not find any controllers. It is mid October and I am frustrated with the new system that I think our team will not be able to compete this year due to all the problems we are having. It seems real sensitive. We have not even got our basic robot to move; one motor may move sometime while the other does not move at all. We had success with the tutorials so far until we actually tried to use two controllers on the robot.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Gkohle: it sounds like this is virtually 100% repeatable for you. Am I understanding that correctly? Would you (or anyone else seeing near 100% failures) consider a hardware swap so we can try to get to the bottom of this? I have extra MR hardware and extra fresh-in-the-box ZTE Speeds: I could ship you replacements of what you're seeing failing and have you ship back what you've got now (phone, controllers, cables and all) so we can have a look. I can't do this for everyone (I don't have that much HW :-) but if someone out there really has a setup that's repeatedly and reliably failing in this manner I think it's worth having a look at. A first (but not mutually-exclusive) thought though: can you get the logcat off the phone (there's recent posts on how to do that, especially a good one from Tom) to see if it can be diagnosed that way?

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by gkohle View Post
                          Our team is having the same problems as all the other teams; If we are lucky we can find one controller, sometimes the scan does not find any controllers. It is mid October and I am frustrated with the new system that I think our team will not be able to compete this year due to all the problems we are having. It seems real sensitive. We have not even got our basic robot to move; one motor may move sometime while the other does not move at all. We had success with the tutorials so far until we actually tried to use two controllers on the robot.
                          gkohle,

                          Are you using ZTE Speed or Motorola Moto G phones as your Android devices? What version of Android is installed on your phone?

                          Tom

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            One test you can do if you suspect the Power module is to bypass it. Use a regular HUB and you can use the same type of cable that goes from the Driver Station phone to the HUB to the gamepads to go from the HUB to the robot controller phone.

                            If you suspect the power side, get an Anderson Powerpole distribution splitter.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by FTC3805 View Post
                              One test you can do if you suspect the Power module is to bypass it. Use a regular HUB and you can use the same type of cable that goes from the Driver Station phone to the HUB to the gamepads to go from the HUB to the robot controller phone.

                              If you suspect the power side, get an Anderson Powerpole distribution splitter.
                              Use the cable and 4 port Hub that came with the Joystick Controllers to test. Be careful, as our first test with a different USB Hub from a PC did not work. But the one that we used with the GamePad Controllers worked every time. That's how we were able to determine that the USB ports were bad on our Core Power Distribution Module. We also noticed that we only had 3 blue lights on our Core Power Mod when things didn't work, and had 4 blue lights when things worked properly. We also noticed that if the Legacy Mod did not have a red light on (when connected to the Core Power Mod and a Phone) then it wouldn't be found during the scans.

                              I have some videos of our troubleshooting that I will post to youtube tonight, but swapping parts or USB Hubs is a good way to figure out what going on.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Tom Eng View Post
                                Hi Folks,
                                ...

                                Modern Robotics ... have identified a situation where some of the earlier Power Modules (but not all, just a limited number) might have an issue which can cause this type of behavior. I am unable to provide specifics, but the condition is similar to a race condition where the USB chips within the Power Module might be waiting indefinitely to receive a reset signal as they are powered on, causing the situation where one or more of the devices are not able to be detected on the USB bus.

                                ...

                                Tom
                                Originally posted by Tom Eng View Post
                                Originally posted by jphigham View Post
                                Any information on what range of CPDM serial numbers might be affected?

                                Regards,
                                Joe Higham
                                Mentor, 18 Techno Chix
                                Hi Joe,

                                That would be a question for Modern Robotics. I'll also ask and see if I can get a serial number range, but feel free to ping MR about this.

                                Tom
                                Hi Tom & FTC,

                                Most if not all of the PDMs were purchased from FIRST; not from MR.

                                Unless FIRST releases the serial numbers of the defective PDMs, the FTC gaming committee will have no choice but to make the PDM optional.

                                The PDM serves no practical purpose in the first place. The PDM costs a lot of money for the sole purpose of taking up a lot of valuable real estate on the robot and for making cable management a nightmare.

                                Comment

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