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New Tech effect on Software Inspection & Control Award

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  • New Tech effect on Software Inspection & Control Award

    Just wondering - With the New Platform, will we see revisions in Software Inspection and the requirements/parameters for the Control Award this season?

  • #2
    I believe software inspection is going away entirely.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by NoahAndrews View Post
      I believe software inspection is going away entirely.
      That doesn't seem reasonable....

      The first thing to be checked would probably be a verification of the correct Driver Station App revision.

      Then, since SW Inspection is primarily verifying that your robot responds to basic driver commands (and doesn't go haywire on the field), these concerns still apply with the new technology...
      It also seems likely that the FTA will want to see your robot run on the field prior to the competition, just in case you happen to have selected a channel that is badly compromised.
      Another consideration might be the choice and operation of the game controllers.

      Phil.

      Comment


      • #4
        I was considering software inspection as being separate from field inspection. I don't know if they've said whether or not field inspection is going away.

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        • #5
          It was originally implied that one of the advantages of the new technology was the elimination of the software and field inspections.
          Jim Bates
          Atlantic County NJ 4-H Robotics
          FLL Teams 71 & 13365
          FTC Team 9765

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by NoahAndrews View Post
            I was considering software inspection as being separate from field inspection. I don't know if they've said whether or not field inspection is going away.
            So I'm wondering then... what aspects of the current "software Inspection" process do you think won't be required any more. It's not as if anyone ever looked at the actual code

            Phil.

            Comment


            • #7
              In our experience, software inspection was flashing the samantha module, checking that the NXT sleep timer was off, checking that the NXT brick had the team number for its name, and checking that bluetooth was off. It would seem that none of these would be needed anymore. What aspect of software inspection that actually occurred do you think will be needed with the new platform?

              Comment


              • #8
                I think I already mentioned a few....

                But, Just because there is no "FCS" doesn't mean that the FTA's won't want to ensure beforehand that all the robots are able to communicate and run
                It's not uncommon to find robots coming to competition with NO SOFTWARE loaded. This is discovered in Software inspection.

                Whether these "checking" items are part of an on-field or off-field experience seems to change from year to year.
                But, working through the 2013 Software inspection sheet, we could infer that many checks will still need to stay, and be adapted to the new system.

                Remember that in many cases these requirements were in place to minimize possible confusion on the field, and enable the FTA to have a starting place for debugging.

                Previous check --- Possible new check.

                Coach -- Same
                Driver1 -- Same
                Driver 2 (optional) -- Same

                NXT Configuration --- I'd assume this would now apply to either the Driver station, Robot or both:

                Samantha unit has the latest firmware and competition connection settings flashed to it. -- Since teams may not HAVE to use an official phone, it's possible that they would have to show that their hardware conforms to the requirements list (Snapdraggon, WiFi Direct, Android 4.4. etc)

                NXT named with team number -- Phones may be required to have Team numbers assigned as their WiFi direct names to be able to identify teams
                NXT Firmware Version: -- Android version number.

                LabVIEW - 1.31 or newer ROBOTC - 9.0 or newer -- It's likely that the Java project/library may have a version number that will be displayed, and need to be verified.
                Samostat program is loaded on the NXT -- no direct equivalent
                Program Chooser program is loaded on the NXT -- I'm sure they will want to check the version of the Driver Station Software.

                NXT Sleep Timer set to NEVER -- It may be required to set phones to have a maximum Screen Sleep interval, to prevent apps from shutting down. Note the ZTE speed doesn't have a "Never" mode.

                Queuing Process
                Team understands that no software changes are allowed in Queue Area. -- Same
                Team understands that the match schedule is only an estimate. -- Same
                Matches may start prior to or after the scheduled time and it is the teams’ responsibility to monitor schedule changes and show up when required. -- Same
                Team knows where to receive alliance flags and where to return them after the match. -- Same

                They may be able to eliminate "Software Inspection" but many of the same activities will need to be some somewhere.

                Phil.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Philbot View Post
                  I think I already mentioned a few....

                  But, Just because there is no "FCS" doesn't mean that the FTA's won't want to ensure beforehand that all the robots are able to communicate and run
                  It's not uncommon to find robots coming to competition with NO SOFTWARE loaded. This is discovered in Software inspection.

                  Whether these "checking" items are part of an on-field or off-field experience seems to change from year to year.
                  But, working through the 2013 Software inspection sheet, we could infer that many checks will still need to stay, and be adapted to the new system.

                  Remember that in many cases these requirements were in place to minimize possible confusion on the field, and enable the FTA to have a starting place for debugging.
                  It's possible that these things might be greatly simplified; a computer running adb and an appropriate script can automatically check/set a lot of these automatically (with humans making decisions on discrepancies) making software inspection more rapid/smooth.
                  FTC6460 mentor (software+computer vision+electronics), FPGA enthusiast. In favor of allowing custom electronics on FTC bots.
                  Co-founder of ##ftc live chat for FTC programming--currently you may need to join and wait some time for help--volunteer basis only.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Philbot View Post
                    I think I already mentioned a few....

                    But, Just because there is no "FCS" doesn't mean that the FTA's won't want to ensure beforehand that all the robots are able to communicate and run
                    It's not uncommon to find robots coming to competition with NO SOFTWARE loaded. This is discovered in Software inspection.

                    Whether these "checking" items are part of an on-field or off-field experience seems to change from year to year.
                    But, working through the 2013 Software inspection sheet, we could infer that many checks will still need to stay, and be adapted to the new system.

                    Remember that in many cases these requirements were in place to minimize possible confusion on the field, and enable the FTA to have a starting place for debugging.

                    Previous check --- Possible new check.

                    Coach -- Same
                    Driver1 -- Same
                    Driver 2 (optional) -- Same

                    NXT Configuration --- I'd assume this would now apply to either the Driver station, Robot or both:

                    Samantha unit has the latest firmware and competition connection settings flashed to it. -- Since teams may not HAVE to use an official phone, it's possible that they would have to show that their hardware conforms to the requirements list (Snapdraggon, WiFi Direct, Android 4.4. etc)

                    NXT named with team number -- Phones may be required to have Team numbers assigned as their WiFi direct names to be able to identify teams
                    NXT Firmware Version: -- Android version number.

                    LabVIEW - 1.31 or newer ROBOTC - 9.0 or newer -- It's likely that the Java project/library may have a version number that will be displayed, and need to be verified.
                    Samostat program is loaded on the NXT -- no direct equivalent
                    Program Chooser program is loaded on the NXT -- I'm sure they will want to check the version of the Driver Station Software.

                    NXT Sleep Timer set to NEVER -- It may be required to set phones to have a maximum Screen Sleep interval, to prevent apps from shutting down. Note the ZTE speed doesn't have a "Never" mode.

                    Queuing Process
                    Team understands that no software changes are allowed in Queue Area. -- Same
                    Team understands that the match schedule is only an estimate. -- Same
                    Matches may start prior to or after the scheduled time and it is the teams’ responsibility to monitor schedule changes and show up when required. -- Same
                    Team knows where to receive alliance flags and where to return them after the match. -- Same

                    They may be able to eliminate "Software Inspection" but many of the same activities will need to be some somewhere.

                    Phil.
                    Fair enough. I thought that the FTC folks had said that one of the main goals of the new system was "practice like you play." If your robot moves on the practice field using the new system, then it should move on the real field using the new system since it's exactly the same stuff and teams are responsible for all of it. If this is their goal, then they might just do away with some of the configuration checks, "are you using the right version of Labview or RobotC" type questions, etc. But then again, maybe they won't.

                    Before, lots of teams ran their robots using bluetooth and had never tried the samantha module or the FCS, so there were lots of things that could go wrong before a robot would work over the FCS. The new system would seem to remove a lot of this.

                    Many of the items on your list that were previously in software inspection really are just making sure that the teams know the rules and don't have much to do with inspecting software. And as you noted, I've never actually seen anybody actually "inspect the software" (e.g., "let's see that "waitForStart" command in your RobotC code", etc.). Perhaps inspections will just be restructured or renamed. I suspect there will be big changes in the Game Manual Part I this year.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yeah,

                      We'll just have to wait and see.
                      Either way, it should be interesting.

                      Phil.

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